DEBATE: PRETRIBULATION OR PREWRATH RAPTURE

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Alan Kurschner presents a convincing case for a PreWrath Rapture i.e. prior to the wrath of God being poured out in the Trumpet and Bowl Judgements. The video is a debate between Alan and Tom Ice who presents the case for a PreTribulation Rapture. It is a 50 minute debate so make sure you schedule sufficient time, and can I suggest you view it with your church group, so that you can discuss it afterward.

Prior to this video, I put up Nelson Walters much shorter video in the post titled, Eloquent Teaching on the Timing of The Rapture. I suggest you watch it prior to Alan’s debate with Tom Ice. Nelson also supports  a PreWrath Rapture.

HAVE CHRISTIANS BEEN MISLED ABOUT SECOND COMING OF JESUS?

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Great to see that Dr Michael Brown has realised that Scripture does not support a Pre-Tribulation Rapture.

Without a doubt, the New Testament proclaims that Jesus will return to earth and establish His Kingdom. And without a doubt, the New Testament calls us to live with readiness and expectation. We can all agree on that.

But does the New Testament teach that, for true believers, Jesus will come suddenly, like a thief in the night, without any signs? Or, to the contrary, does it teach that His coming will not be like a thief in the night for godly believers, since we are awake and alert, fully aware of the signs of the times?

“To be clear, I don’t doubt for a moment that we’re living in prophetic times”, said Dr Brown

The gospel is spreading all over the world in unprecedented fashion, just as the Scriptures predicted.

Out of the ashes of the Holocaust, Israel has been re-birthed, and Jerusalem remains at the centre of world attention, again, in accordance with the prophets’ words.

And around the globe, Christians are being brutally persecuted for their faith, mowed down by the hundreds and thousands. This too is in harmony with Scripture, which speak of the last days as times of great blessing and great upheaval, of great light and great darkness, or great victory and great conflict. Jesus promised that Christians would not experience the wrath of God but Scripture shows us that in the end times, God’s wrath is poured out at the Trumpet and Bowl Judgements. The Rapture occurs after the sixth seal. John saw the great multitude that no one could number of believers before the throne clothed in white robes (resurrected bodies) and waving palm branches just prior to the seventh seal being opened and the trumpet judgements commencing.

Despite the popular theology of our day, Christians should not expect to get out of experiencing the tribulation or the end times. Nowhere in the Bible does the Lord promise us this, say Michael Brown and Craig Keener, two leading, acclaimed Bible scholars. In fact, they say, Jesus promises us tribulation in this world.

Yet this is no reason to fear. In this fascinating, accessible, and personal book, Brown and Keener walk you through what the Bible really says about the rapture, the tribulation, and the end times. What they find will leave you full of hope. God’s wrath is not poured out on His people, and He will shield us from it–as he shielded Israel in Egypt during the ten plagues. So instead of taking comfort in what God hasn’t promised, take comfort in the words of Jesus: He has overcome the world, and we live in his victory.

MARK OF THE BEAST: MICROCHIP IMPLANTS?

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End-Times Scholar: Microchips Are Scary Next Step to Control Population

A technology growing in popularity allows computer chips to be implanted under the skin. It brings to mind the “mark of the beast” prophesied in Revelation 13:16-17. For the first time in history, technology has made it possible.

Christian activists, including conspiracy theorist Mark Dice, the author of a book titled The Resistance Manifesto, make the link between chipping of humans and the biblical mark of the beast prophesied to be a future requirement for buying and selling.

It will be very attractive to governments in order to control people and their finances. Moreover, they can put a positive spin on its implementation. It has so much potential for good that it is almost inevitable that governments will want to use this,” Rabbi Pinchas Winston, a prolific end-of-days author, said. “They can’t afford prisons and policing anymore for the expanding populations. Rather than put someone in prison, they can make it impossible to exit their home. If they identify a criminal, they can remotely shut down their car, deny them access to money and food. A lot of people will be deterred from non-compliance with the law.

The process is relatively simple. An identifying integrated circuit device or Radio-frequency identification (RFID) transponder encased in silicate glass approximately the size of a grain of rice is implanted under the skin using a device similar to a syringe. Local anaesthetic is used during the procedure. The use of sub-dermal RFIDs for domestic and farm animals is widespread and some countries require them to be implanted This was first done by a physician in 1998 and was approved for use in humans by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) in 2004.

Proponents of this new technology claim a myriad of benefits. Some companies currently recommend implantation for their employees for security purposes. Locks and elevators can be paired with sensors so that only specific people can open a door. Computers can use the sensor to identify users when they log on, allowing them to access files and systems specific to them. Using the chip as “biopayment” in place of a credit card is in the developmental stages and could lead to a cashless society. It is also feasible to create a smart gun that will only allow the owner of a gun to fire it. Theoretically, a GPS-enabled chip could one day make it possible for individuals to be physically located anywhere on the planet. The chip can link to an external database containing vital medical information for emergency use. This would be especially useful in cases of dementia or where the patient is uncooperative. It can also be used by law enforcement agencies to identify subjects and track their movements. Both of these applications raise serious concerns about civil liberties.

Folks we are in the “last days”, are you prepared for the coming tribulation spoken of by Jesus and Daniel.

 

TIMING OF THE RAPTURE

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The debate between pretribulation and prewrath rapture scholars about Paul’s second letter to the Thessalonians has been fierce – mostly centred around 2 Thess. 2:3 and the meaning of the Greek word apostasia.

Image result for book Rapture Case Cosed by Neslon Walters

Dr Nelson Walters of Gospel in the End Times has written about that passage at length in his book Rapture: Case Closed?  However, he points out in this presentation that very little discussion has taken place about the passage that precedes 2 Thess. 2 and provides its “context,” that is 2 Thess. 1. The eschatological material in chapters one and two are really one continuous teaching! We cannot understand chapter two without understanding chapter one that provides introductory thoughts on the more hotly contested chapter.

Nelson does a stellar job of presenting the Prewrath case for the timing of the Rapture in this seven minute video.

 

YOUR END-TIME THEOLOGY IS VITAL

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Your End-Time Theology Does Matter

The life of the church must be driven by the truth that Jesus is returning, and we must be prepared for our role during that key season. Jesus makes it clear in the Olivet Discourse, that Christians will face the ANTICHRIST during the Tribulation and even Great Tribulation, occurring during the 70th week spoken of by Daniel.

“Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand), “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains… For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened. Matthew 24:15-21

The Bible warns that there will be a great falling away in the church in the “last days”, even the elect being deceived. The charismatic, miracle working Antichrist will appeal to many in the apostate church which has already compromised with the world on homosexuality and gay marriage.

The following warning in Revelation should be awake up call: “A third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, he also shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out in full strength into the cup of His anger. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. The smoke of their torment will ascend forever and ever. They have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image and whoever receives the mark of his name (Revelation 14:9-11).

The truth is that we are only safe if we conquer, overcome and endure to the end: “He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments. I will not blot his name out of the Book of Life, but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels” (Revelation 3:5).

If all of our sins are forgiven, past, present and future, then taking the mark of the beast is a non-issue. In fact, blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, sexual immorality, unforgiveness and any number of other sins won’t impact our eternity if we believe in a false grace teaching.

“For if we wilfully continue to sin after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgement and fiery indignation, which will devour the adversaries” (Hebrews 10:26-27).

A raging, burning passion for Jesus is non-negotiable. We are either on fire for Jesus or we are lukewarm, or possible cold and dead. Those who refuse to take the mark of the beast will be radically in love and on fire for Jesus.

“I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were cold or hot. So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spit you out of My mouth” (Revelation 3:15-16).

We must be living, walking and praying in the Spirit, night and day if we hope to survive the coming pressure. You’ll remember Jesus warning his disciples to stay awake and pray so they wouldn’t fall into temptation. Do you know what temptation Jesus was referring to? Rejecting Jesus, as they did when the pressure increased and Jesus was taken away for crucifixion: “Watch and pray that you enter not into temptation. The spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak” (Matthew 26:41).

“The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom, and the knowledge of the Holy One is understanding” (Proverbs. 9:10).

We will need each other more than ever as the pressure intensifies. The church will certainly look much different during the Tribulation than it does now, but one truth will remain—we will be together. We must learn how to lock arms and contend together if we hope to survive in the end. The Bible gives us this instruction, especially as the Day of the Lord draws near.

“And let us consider how to spur one another to love and to good works. Let us not forsake the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but let us exhort one another, especially as you see the Day approaching” (Hebrews 10:24-25).

We must be ready. Jesus is coming again soon. That is one point we must simply have to agree on.

SIGNS TO WATCH FOR, PRIOR TO JESUS RETURN

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Jesus does not teach a sign-less, imminent rapture. There are key discernible events/signs that must happen before Jesus returns for his church.

Jesus gave us due warning with signs/events that will occur prior to His return: 

  1. Israel will be reestablished – Jesus told the parable of the fig tree (Israel) when you see it sprouting (reborn). “So you also, when you see these things happening, know that the kingdom of God is near.” Luke 21;31
  2. “False messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. “Remember, I have told you ahead of time.“ Mark 13:21-22
  3.  “And you will hear of wars and rumours of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.” Matthew 24:6
  4. “For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of sorrows.” Matthew 24:7
  5. There will be signs in the sun and moon and stars, and on the earth nations will be in distress, anxious over the roaring of the sea and the surging waves. People will be fainting from fear and from the expectation of what is coming on the world, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. “But when these things begin to happen, stand up and raise your heads, because your redemption is drawing near.”
  6. “Now regarding the arrival of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to be with him… Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not arrive until the rebellion comes and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction. He opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, and as a result he takes his seat in God’s temple, displaying himself as God. Surely you recall that I used to tell you these things while I was still with you.” 2 Thessalonians 2:1–5
  7. “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and takes the mark on his forehead or his hand, that person will also drink of the wine of God’s anger that has been mixed undiluted in the cup of his wrath, and he will be tortured with fire and sulphur in front of the holy angels and in front of the Lamb… This requires the steadfast endurance of the saints—those who obey God’s commandments and hold to their faith in Jesus.” Revelation 14:9–12
  8. So when you see the abomination of desolation–spoken about by Daniel the prophet—standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), then those in Judea must flee to the mountains.

Sadly, much of the church has been deceived into believing a Pretribulation Rapture. The Bible clearly teaches in these Scriptures that the Saints will experience tribulation even great tribulation. However, the Bible also teaches the Saints will be raptured at the sixth seal before God pours out His wrath upon the earth in the trumpet and bowl judgements.

JESUS SECOND COMING

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Does the Bible provide much information on Jesus’ Second Coming?

There is more prophetic evidence about Jesus’ second coming than any other prophetic event in the Bible. The end times is the most written-about subject in all of Scripture. There are over 150 chapters in the Bible in which the majority of the chapter is about the end times.  Most of the prophets spoke about the future “Day of the Lord” which relates to the events of Jesus’ coming. For more information go to Mike Bickle’s article entitled “150 Chapters on the End Times.” I can also recommend Nelson Walters book, Revelation Deciphered.

Why is it important that we study “end times” prophecies, particularly the Book of Revelation?

Studying what the Bible has to say about the future empowers us to be victorious in love and power during the most glorious and difficult time in history. It prepares us to actively participate under Jesus in the end-time events and to rightly interpret Jesus’ leadership in the coming global crisis instead of being offended by Him (Matthew 11:6). Studying the end times awakens urgency in us for intercession, knowing that our prayers may minimise evil and increase victory. Understanding end-time Scriptures strengthens our confidence in God’s sovereignty by knowing that He is in control and is never surprised (Joel 2:13-14; Zephaniah 2:3; Matthew 11:6, 24:4; Philippians 1:10; Revelation 12:11).

 How can we be confident that we are living in the “last days”?

There are many biblical trends that reveal “the season or generation” of His coming (Matthew 24:4-8). They include an increase of wickedness (Daniel 8:23, Revelation 14:9), apostasy in the church, the increase of knowledge (Daniel 12;4), emergence of global prayer (Isaiah 56:7), the great harvest from all nations (Matthew 24:14, Revelation 7:9).

Are we able to know the signs of the times?

Yes, Jesus commanded the people who lived in the generation of His return to know the signs (Matt. 24:32-4). Jesus rebuked those who did not heed the prophetic signs that pointed to His coming (Matt. 16:1-4; Luke 19:41-44). Prophetic signs serve the church in the same way that a weather station signals coming trouble so that people can prepare and save lives.

Can the signs of the times be understood?

Yes. The Scriptures on the end times and the signs of the times were written to be understood by all, since the majority of people throughout history have been uneducated peasants. The Scripture was written for them. Jesus and Paul emphasised the know-ability of the prophetic signs of the end times (Matt. 24:32-34, Luke 21:25-29, 1 Thess. 5:1-6, 2 Thess. 2:1-11). The lie is that we are not to know the times and seasons of His return (Acts 1:7-8).

How can we know when Jesus is coming if He says in Matthew 24:36 that “no one knows” the day or the hour? Jesus did not say we could not know the season or the conditions surrounding His coming. Neither did Jesus say that the church would not know the day and hour in the generation the Lord returns. We must seek the Father’s Word as to when this begins, because only the Father knows. God did not want to make the day and hour known in the early church, but Daniel and the apostle John made it clear that the Messiah would come exactly 1,260 days after the abomination of desolation (Dan. 7:25; 12:7; Rev. 11:2-3,12:6, 14; 13:5).

Will the church be on earth during the Tribulation and Great Tribulation spoken of by Daniel (Daniel 9:24-27)?

Yes. The church will absolutely be on the earth during six of the seven years of the Tribulation and Great Tribulation. However, the church will not experience the wrath of God, which is poured out in the trumpet and bowl judgements during the seventh year, prior to Jesus Second Coming to earth with the Saints who were raptured at the sixth seal. The last verse describing the events of the sixth seal announces “For the great day of His wrath has come, and who can stand? (Revelation 6:17). John then sees the resurrected and raptured saints (great multitude which no one could number of all nations, tribes and peoples and tongues standing before the throne and before the lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands.” (Revelation 7:9). This prior to the trumpet and bowl judgements being poured out on unrepentant mankind.

 The end times is the church’s finest hour, when miracles will occur and supernatural prophetic direction will be released. The miracles of Acts and Exodus will be multiplied and combined on a global level (Mic. 7:15). The victorious believer in Revelation 12:11 will overcome Satan by the blood of the Lamb, the word of their testimony and the fact that they did not love their lives to the death.

 

Extracts from article by Mike Bickle: Answers the 100 most frequently asked questions about the End Times. Although I have taken a PreWrath Rapture position and I believe Mike Bickle takes the Post Tribulation position. He is the director of the International House of Prayer Missions Base of Kansas City, Missouri,

TENETS OF PREWRATH RAPTURE

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As some of my followers will have determined, I hold to a Prewrath Rapture position. It means that Christians will go through the tribulation period outlined by Daniel and John in Revelation, but not be subjected to the wrath of God that is poured out during the trumpet and bowl judgements.

For those of you who would like to explore this position further, I can recommend the resources produced by Alan Kurschner – Antichrist: Before the Day of the Lord and Nelson Walters – Rapture Case Closed? both who hold to the Prewrath Rapture position.

Don’t forget you can find sermons and videos relevant for these “last days” available for download on my other website http://www.powerpointsermons.net

I found the following fifteen tenets of the Prewrath position as outlined on Alan Kurschner’s website a great help and I hope you do too.

  1. There is a future seven-year period, and at the midpoint the Antichrist will be revealed and commit the abomination of desolation, initiating his great tribulation against the Church and Israel.
  2. There is a biblical distinction between the Antichrist’s great tribulation against the Church and Israel and the day of the Lord’s wrath against the ungodly. The latter event happens after the former event.
  3. The gathering of the elect mentioned in Matthew 24:31 refers to the rapture (cf. Mark 13:27; Luke 21:28; Rev 7:9–17; 1 Thess 4:13–18; 2 Thess 2:1).
  4. At an unknown day and hour during the second half of the seven-year period, the Antichrist’s great tribulation will be cut short by the Revelation of Christ to resurrect and rapture God’s people, and this will be followed immediately by the day of the Lord’s wrath with the trumpet and bowl judgements.
  5. On the same day the rapture happens, the onset of the day of the Lord’s wrath takes place, just as it was in the days of Noah and Lot (Luke 17:22–37; cf. 2 Thess 1:5–10).
  6. The second coming (parousia) is not a simple (instantaneous) event. The second coming is a complex-whole event containing various purposes of God, beginning with the Revelation of Christ in the sky displaying his Shekinah glory and power to the whole world, and resurrecting and rapturing God’s people, followed by the day of the Lord’s judgments upon the ungodly and Antichrist’s kingdom, restoring Israel to salvation, and culminating in Christ’s earthly reign.
  7. Although Armageddon is an element within the complex-whole second coming, Armageddon does not initiate the second coming; instead, the second coming begins between the sixth and seventh seal.
  8. The resurrection and rapture happens between the opening of the sixth seal and the seventh seal.
  9. The first six seals are not part of the day of the Lord’s wrath. The first six seals are conditional events that must happen before Christ’s return.
  10. The sixth seal signals the impending day of the Lord’s wrath as recorded in Joel 2:30–31; Matthew 24:29; Luke 21:25–26; Mark 13:23–25; and Revelation 6:12–17.
  11. The seventh seal pronounces the day of the Lord’s wrath.
  12. The trumpets, bowls, and Armageddon contain and execute the day of the Lord’s wrath.
  13. The trumpets, bowls, and Armageddon will not occur before the seventh seal is opened.
  14. Paul’s “last trumpet” (1 Cor 15:52) is not the seventh trumpet judgment in the book of Revelation.
  15. Christ’s return to resurrect and rapture God’s people is not imminent (“any moment”), since discernible prophesied events must happen first (e.g., the Antichrist’s revelation and his ensuing great tribulation; the apostasy; coming of Elijah; and a cluster of discernible celestial events). Christ can return in any generation of the Church.

—Alan Kurschner, 08/01/12

EVENTS THAT WILL TAKE PLACE BEFORE JESUS RETURNS

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“Now when they are saying, ‘There is peace and security,’ then sudden destruction comes on them, like labour pains on a pregnant woman, and they will surely not escape. But you, brothers and sisters, are not in the darkness for the day to overtake you like a thief would.” 1 Thess 5:3–4

Paul’s reassurance to the Thessalonians implies that they were anxious that they might not escape the day of the Lord and therefore endure God’s wrath. Paul confirms Christians will be raptured before God’s wrath is poured out on an unbelieving world. It is at the end of the sixth seal being opened that His wrath commences: “For the great day of His wrath has come who can stand.” (Rev. 6:17) The seven trumpet and seven bowl judgements are the wrath of God.

Note, Paul contrasts the ungodly, who will not escape because Christ is coming back as a thief for them (as in the days of Noah) , with believers who are obedient-vigilant and “not in the darkness for the day to overtake you like a thief would.” Incidentally, this reassuring promise undermines the pretribulational notion that Jesus is secretly coming back as a thief for his church.

During the Antichrist’s great tribulation, the world will experience peace and security for those who are loyal to him. Hence, Paul prophesies that the world will be saying, “There is peace and security” before Jesus returns to mete out His day of the Lord’s wrath upon the wicked.

The church will be here to witness the ungodly exclaiming that they are experiencing peace and safety. This prophecy that Paul mentions undermines imminence because it will happen before, not after, the rapture.

This is just another prophesied event in a long series of intervening events that will happen before the rapture—rendering the pretribulation teaching of imminence contradictory in light of this biblical evidence. [1]

The peace and safety will be illusory, a false security for unbelievers, because eventually unforeseen calamity will come upon them just as unexpected labour pains come upon a pregnant woman.

We should be careful not to confuse Paul’s use of the birth pangs analogy with Jesus’ purpose in using the same phrasing in the Olivet Discourse (“All these things are the beginning of birth pains,” Matt 24:8). Paul uses the phrase in a completely different application. Jesus applies the birth pangs metaphor to particular events before the .Antichrist’s great tribulation, while Paul applies it to the situation of the onset of the day of the Lord’s wrath  after the great tribulation.

For a more in depth coverage go to alankurschner.com – The Prophecy – “There is peace and security” contradicts Pretribulation Theology.

IMPORTANCE OF RAPTURE TIMING

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Increasingly, this site will focus on prophesied end times as they unfold in our time. The aim, to equip believers to use prophecy in evangelism. As I have mentioned in previous posts, there are far more prophecies about Jesus Second Coming than there were about His First coming. All the OT prophets were given a picture of a restored Israel with Jesus (descendant of King David) ruling and reigning from Jerusalem.

Isaiah, Daniel, Ezekiel, Nehemiah, Zechariah, and Micah are all stand outs for me in providing us with pictures of future “end times” events. All through Isaiah we get snippets of Jesus ruling from Jerusalem. As early as Isaiah 2, we read “Now it shall come to pass in the latter days, that the mountain of the Lord’s house shall be firmly established above other mountains, and exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow to it. Many people shall come and say, come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob; He will teach us His ways, and we shall walk in His paths. For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem. He shall judge between the nations, and rebuke many people; they shall beat their swords into ploughshares  and their spears into pruning hooks; Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore”. Isaiah then goes on to paint a picture of The Day of the Lord when the Lord alone will be exalted on that day, everything proud and lofty, everything lifted up will be brought low.

As Nelson Walters states in this important video, the timing of the Rapture is not just a theological debate, its timing is critical, in terms of whether the church will face the tribulation, and even great tribulation outlined in Daniel’s 70th week. In the Olivet Discourse (Matthew 24, Mark 13, Luke 21), Jesus gave His disciples and us, a lot of information about His Second Coming. He said, many times, WATCH, BE ALERT, for it will be like the days of Noah, they will be eating, sleeping etc and suddenly, He will appear in the clouds with the angels and every eye will see Him, believers will be taken up, but most look for rocks to hide under. God then pours out His wrath upon the unrepentant in the Trumpet and Bowl Judgements.